A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

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Spider1V
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Hello All,
 
Whether you are an existing G Wagen owner, a new member, an old member or just taking a look, I hope you find our website of interest and look forward to seeing some questions and answers and G Wagen related news and banter you may have.
 
As the Southern Area Rep for the GWOA I am often asked for 'what to look for' when buying a G, well apart from some excellent stuff/advice in the 'Sticky' section above, here is a classic example of a Good G, waiting for a new owner! laugh

http://www.gwoa.co.uk/content/1985-w460-280ge-lwb-right-hand-drive

Why? Because it ticks the following Boxes as a potential new owner you should be looking for:

1. Its a members truck and there is the VIN for all to see
2. Its a fair price
3. The member has put it up and not contacted new members via the PM facility (unless agreed)
4. There is history (the three files) and an open and truthful overview that matches the pic's and the video.
5. The member has described the history, the key updates and what has been done.
6. The fact that the member still will have a G in his stable
7. Explained the aditional extras - e.g rear jumps seats/congestions charing exempt. etc
 
I CANNOT EMPHASISE TO NEW MEMBERS OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC LOOKING FOR A G WAGEN, DEMAND IS FAR OUTSTRIPPING SUPPLY IN THE UK. 
 
With the 35 Year anniversary for the G almost upon us, there are people out there who will gladly take your money and sell you a 'pig in the poke'. Do your research, ask the questions, do not let the 'G Fever' take a hold - though it's so tempting! wink 
 
If its an honest G the seller will post openly, I warn you now about unsolicited contacts. The only 'official' G Wagen suppliers are sent out via the Chairman's Letters or are listed here on the forum. The GWOA can help you; through advice, answering questions and experience of G ownership.  What we can not do is help you after the event, especially if you have not asked the questions and done your research.
 
I write this as a warning, based on experience of having to pick up the pieces afterwards, which is both upsetting and taxing on the emotions. It leaves a bad feeling all around and generally put people off the joy and excitement of G Wagen Ownership. Lets face it.............Its a know fact that G Wagen Owners are seen as the 'Thinking Person's' Off Roader!!
 
Please heed my warning and view the above as a perfect example of what you should be looking for when considering your perfect G.
 
Hope that helps
 
Joe Askew
Southern Area Rep
GWOA
(aka Spider1V)
 
 
Audiominx
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Couldn't have put it better myself!!

Also good to share the knowledge that so many of you have, as I found out after my crash with all the helpful posts I received. Really useful for the clueless ones amongst us, reading stuff on the forum without feeling silly and having to ask!

diesel_jim
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Thanks for that Joe, useful stuff.

 

nice LWB there as well.... Hmmmm.... how can I increase my savings by a few thousand.....

Norfolk66
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Joe,

What good honest sound advice that any new/old G Wagen owner should take on board..

I only wish I had rejoined the GWOA and taken this sound advice before purchasing my latest G Wagen......alas when I viewed mine I had taken my 85 year old father with Altzeihmers and a new dog for the ride and couldn't view it properly!

However, the G was advertised with the wording of any RAC/AA inspection welcome and being sold at a reasonable price as the owner had also stated that there was also a steering judder that would be fixed with the purchase of a steering damper at £69 but would all be fixed if I paid the buy it now price.....I declined and took my chance as all the above sounded fair.(Pig 'n' Poke as you state...and I bought it on face value)

'G Fever' had re-gripped me and I went ahead with the purchase thinking a new steering damper was all that was needed. Now some 6 months and thousands of pounds down the line nearly everything has been rebuilt and I am about to take my G Wagen to a true G Wagen guru to fully diagnose the vibration problem.

The lessons to be learnt from me are :-

1. If it seems too good to be true it is!
2. Post any G Wagen reg on the forum and you will get a good history back in seconds.
3. Post the price and ask others if it is fair.
4. 99% of G Wagen owners (even current and past members) with think their G is the best and states of repair, workmanship and quality are all very subjective and personal opinion.
5. Take a G Wagen expert with you as they will usually do anything for a few beers and a free meal :-)
6. All that glitters is not gold....

All above said the G that you have mentioned looks a fantastic honest buy and would have been very high on my shopping list 6 months ago.

If you cannot get a member to visit with you take the AA or RAC with you as it will be the best £70 or so you will spend. Any honest seller will I'm sure take this off the asking price to get the sale.

Failing all above buy one that you know the full history of...there is a great one in Somerset that I have been taken out in and seen the quality of re-built/conversion that should last a lifetime. 

There is a separate threat already on this I think...?

Anyway...my G is still very much a work in progress and is getting there (full new service and breaking system, bearings, hub seals,engine mounts, all other seals, new screen, rubbers, seats, trim and lining) all good things come to those that wait....'Well that's what my mum says'!

Happy New Year to all from Royal Norfolk 

btw...Joe, Rakesh,Gav, please txt me your mobile as I lost your numbers whilst drinking too much Chablis at Xmas :-)

foneman
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Spider1V wrote:

Hello All,
 
Whether you are an existing G Wagen owner, a new member, an old member or just taking a look, I hope you find our website of interest and look forward to seeing some questions and answers and G Wagen related news and banter you may have.
 
As the Southern Area Rep for the GWOA I am often asked for 'what to look for' when buying a G, well apart from some excellent stuff/advice in the 'Sticky' section above, here is a classic example of a Good G, waiting for a new owner! laugh

http://www.gwoa.co.uk/content/1985-w460-280ge-lwb-right-hand-drive

Why? Because it ticks the following Boxes as a potential new owner you should be looking for:

1. Its a members truck and there is the VIN for all to see
2. Its a fair price
3. The member has put it up and not contacted new members via the PM facility (unless agreed)
4. There is history (the three files) and an open and truthful overview that matches the pic's and the video.
5. The member has described the history, the key updates and what has been done.
6. The fact that the member still will have a G in his stable
7. Explained the aditional extras - e.g rear jumps seats/congestions charing exempt. etc
 
I CANNOT EMPHASISE TO NEW MEMBERS OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC LOOKING FOR A G WAGEN, DEMAND IS FAR OUTSTRIPPING SUPPLY IN THE UK. 
 
With the 35 Year anniversary for the G almost upon us, there are people out there who will gladly take your money and sell you a 'pig in the poke'. Do your research, ask the questions, do not let the 'G Fever' take a hold - though it's so tempting! wink 
 
If its an honest G the seller will post openly, I warn you now about unsolicited contacts. The only 'official' G Wagen suppliers are sent out via the Chairman's Letters or are listed here on the forum. The GWOA can help you; through advice, answering questions and experience of G ownership.  What we can not do is help you after the event, especially if you have not asked the questions and done your research.
 
I write this as a warning, based on experience of having to pick up the pieces afterwards, which is both upsetting and taxing on the emotions. It leaves a bad feeling all around and generally put people off the joy and excitement of G Wagen Ownership. Lets face it.............Its a know fact that G Wagen Owners are seen as the 'Thinking Person's' Off Roader!!
 
Please heed my warning and view the above as a perfect example of what you should be looking for when considering your perfect G.
 
Hope that helps
 
Joe Askew
Southern Area Rep
GWOA
(aka Spider1V)
 
 

Spider1V wrote:

Hello All,
 
Whether you are an existing G Wagen owner, a new member, an old member or just taking a look, I hope you find our website of interest and look forward to seeing some questions and answers and G Wagen related news and banter you may have.
 
As the Southern Area Rep for the GWOA I am often asked for 'what to look for' when buying a G, well apart from some excellent stuff/advice in the 'Sticky' section above, here is a classic example of a Good G, waiting for a new owner! laugh

http://www.gwoa.co.uk/content/1985-w460-280ge-lwb-right-hand-drive

Why? Because it ticks the following Boxes as a potential new owner you should be looking for:

1. Its a members truck and there is the VIN for all to see
2. Its a fair price
3. The member has put it up and not contacted new members via the PM facility (unless agreed)
4. There is history (the three files) and an open and truthful overview that matches the pic's and the video.
5. The member has described the history, the key updates and what has been done.
6. The fact that the member still will have a G in his stable
7. Explained the aditional extras - e.g rear jumps seats/congestions charing exempt. etc
 
I CANNOT EMPHASISE TO NEW MEMBERS OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC LOOKING FOR A G WAGEN, DEMAND IS FAR OUTSTRIPPING SUPPLY IN THE UK. 
 
With the 35 Year anniversary for the G almost upon us, there are people out there who will gladly take your money and sell you a 'pig in the poke'. Do your research, ask the questions, do not let the 'G Fever' take a hold - though it's so tempting! wink 
 
If its an honest G the seller will post openly, I warn you now about unsolicited contacts. The only 'official' G Wagen suppliers are sent out via the Chairman's Letters or are listed here on the forum. The GWOA can help you; through advice, answering questions and experience of G ownership.  What we can not do is help you after the event, especially if you have not asked the questions and done your research.
 
I write this as a warning, based on experience of having to pick up the pieces afterwards, which is both upsetting and taxing on the emotions. It leaves a bad feeling all around and generally put people off the joy and excitement of G Wagen Ownership. Lets face it.............Its a know fact that G Wagen Owners are seen as the 'Thinking Person's' Off Roader!!
 
Please heed my warning and view the above as a perfect example of what you should be looking for when considering your perfect G.
 
Hope that helps
 
Joe Askew
Southern Area Rep
GWOA
(aka Spider1V)
 
 

 

Very well put Joe 

Buyer Beware at all times 

Audiominx
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Just to mention that I had an RAC report done when I bought mine and they do maintain that they only do a visual reposrt. They don't do any serious rummaging. Two weeks after I bought mine one of the rear shock absorber mounts disintegrated. The other was not far off. it was very easily visible so it is quite surprising that they missed it. To be fair, they did not quibble and paid for the repairs without any fuss.

So your advice about taking someone who really knows G Wagens is really pertinent.

Sorry to hear about yours though. It is horrible when things go wrong like that. Really takes the gloss out of it

Also I will just say that posting things openly on the forum is really helpful as it allows everyone to see and add their input

axel
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

  

    FOLLOWING ON FROM THIS EXCELLENT THREAD , THE FOLLOWING POST MAY BE OF INTEREST.

    THESE PICTURES ARE MY COPYRIGHT (MICHAEL AXEL-BERG 2014)

     THIS VEHICLE HAS JUST BEEN RESTORED AND DELIVERED TO THE OWNER / WE ARE STORING IT FOR HIM ,WHEN IT TURNED UP WE INSPECTED IT - PLEASE JUDGE FOR YOURSELVES ...

   all members old and new must be very careful to research a used 'g' wagen if they are buying and also be SO CAREFUL WHO YOU TRUST WITH WORKING ON YOUR VEHICLE .

   this sorry episode has just happened to a member , his 'g' has been subjected to a restoration by a 'g' wagen specialist who claimed to be able to produce quote 'perfection' .

 the following pictures are AFTER restoration NOT BEFORE...   THIS IS THE FINISHED ARTICLE.

 this job including buying the vehicle stands the owner at a figure in excess of £11k / we are now having to do nearly all the work again , the owner has been left with a disaster /it can be rectified but it should never of happened . 

  this isthe worst  work /attention to detail i have ever seen in my life / rotten rusty suspension welded up/ terrible repair ethics plating over rotten inner wings leaving the rusted metal underneath/ a rotted leaking battery tray leaking water into the footwell/ rusted metal ,grinder grit,mig wire wedged down the front of the dashboard panel, rust is already coming through around the rear lights already...

 the front suspension location bar bracket has been bent in an accident at some time and has been cut off /bent straight and welded back on again(not by the restorer but they failed to identify it), the person who worked on this vehicle should of spotted this (BEING A G SPECIALIST)/ i found it in 5 minutes... we have had to remove this buckled and bent bracket and fit a brand new mercedes item / along with a pair of new  rear shock mounts and carry out a careful and thorough repair to the spring platforms (both of which were badly corroded)

 PLEASE CHECK OUT A VEHICLE OR SERVICE PROVIDER FIRST BY ASKING ON THE FORUM.

   DO NOT JUST TAKE WHAT YOU ARE TOLD AT FACE VALUE .

    GO ON THE FORUM /ASK OTHER MEMBERS /GET REFERENCES FOR  WHO YOU ARE DEALING WITH.

    BE VERY VERY CAREFUL OF BEING APPROACHED VIA PRIVATE MESSAGE .

    THIS HAS JUST HAPPENED TO A MEMBER OF GWOA ,HIS 'G' WILL TAKE A LOT OF SAVING FROM THIS MESS .

     

SO LET   THERE BE NO MISTAKE -THIS HAPPENED AND IT IS POSSIBLY GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN  -

   DO NOT NOT LET IT BE YOU!  THE OWNER HAS LOST A LOT OF MONEY AND HE STILL HAS NOT GOT HIS G WAGEN.

   THE GWOA IS A PROFESSIONAL CLUB AND THEREFORE I CANNOT NAME OR SHAME THIS PERSON ,AND I WILL NOT ENTER INTO A GUESSING GAME AS TO WHO THIS MAY BE , I WOULD ALSO SUGGEST IT WOULD NOT BE APPROPRIATE TO SPECULATE PUBLICLY AS TO THEIR IDENTITY.

   PLEASE BE CAREFUL -WHO YOU ENTRUST YOUR VEHICLE TO.

   PEOPLE WHO DID THIS -  TOTAL CRETINS  !! BODGETASTIC!

Spider1V
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Axel,

Many thanks for this post!
 
Its amazing the work is horrific and this is after the 'restoration'? This is what I have now seen 4 or 5 times and can not reiterate enough to new members please be careful. 
 
 
Keep Calm and Do Your Research!
 
 
Spider1V
mortinson
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

axel wrote:

  

    FOLLOWING ON FROM THIS EXCELLENT THREAD , THE FOLLOWING POST MAY BE OF INTEREST.

    THESE PICTURES ARE MY COPYRIGHT (MICHAEL AXEL-BERG 2014)

     THIS VEHICLE HAS JUST BEEN RESTORED AND DELIVERED TO THE OWNER / WE ARE STORING IT FOR HIM ,WHEN IT TURNED UP WE INSPECTED IT - PLEASE JUDGE FOR YOURSELVES ...

   all members old and new must be very careful to research a used 'g' wagen if they are buying and also be SO CAREFUL WHO YOU TRUST WITH WORKING ON YOUR VEHICLE .

   this sorry episode has just happened to a member , his 'g' has been subjected to a restoration by a 'g' wagen specialist who claimed to be able to produce quote 'perfection' .

 the following pictures are AFTER restoration NOT BEFORE...   THIS IS THE FINISHED ARTICLE.

 this job including buying the vehicle stands the owner at a figure in excess of £11k / we are now having to do nearly all the work again , the owner has been left with a disaster /it can be rectified but it should never of happened . 

  this isthe worst  work /attention to detail i have ever seen in my life / rotten rusty suspension welded up/ terrible repair ethics plating over rotten inner wings leaving the rusted metal underneath/ a rotted leaking battery tray leaking water into the footwell/ rusted metal ,grinder grit,mig wire wedged down the front of the dashboard panel, rust is already coming through around the rear lights already...

 the front suspension location bar bracket has been bent in an accident at some time and has been cut off /bent straight and welded back on again(not by the restorer but they failed to identify it), the person who worked on this vehicle should of spotted this (BEING A G SPECIALIST)/ i found it in 5 minutes... we have had to remove this buckled and bent bracket and fit a brand new mercedes item / along with a pair of new  rear shock mounts and carry out a careful and thorough repair to the spring platforms (both of which were badly corroded)

 PLEASE CHECK OUT A VEHICLE OR SERVICE PROVIDER FIRST BY ASKING ON THE FORUM.

   DO NOT JUST TAKE WHAT YOU ARE TOLD AT FACE VALUE .

    GO ON THE FORUM /ASK OTHER MEMBERS /GET REFERENCES FOR  WHO YOU ARE DEALING WITH.

    BE VERY VERY CAREFUL OF BEING APPROACHED VIA PRIVATE MESSAGE .

    THIS HAS JUST HAPPENED TO A MEMBER OF GWOA ,HIS 'G' WILL TAKE A LOT OF SAVING FROM THIS MESS .

     

SO LET   THERE BE NO MISTAKE -THIS HAPPENED AND IT IS POSSIBLY GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN  -

   DO NOT NOT LET IT BE YOU!  THE OWNER HAS LOST A LOT OF MONEY AND HE STILL HAS NOT GOT HIS G WAGEN.

   THE GWOA IS A PROFESSIONAL CLUB AND THEREFORE I CANNOT NAME OR SHAME THIS PERSON ,AND I WILL NOT ENTER INTO A GUESSING GAME AS TO WHO THIS MAY BE , I WOULD ALSO SUGGEST IT WOULD NOT BE APPROPRIATE TO SPECULATE PUBLICLY AS TO THEIR IDENTITY.

   PLEASE BE CAREFUL -WHO YOU ENTRUST YOUR VEHICLE TO.

   PEOPLE WHO DID THIS -  TOTAL CRETINS  !! BODGETASTIC!

 

Axel,

I think that this self-proclaimed G-Wagen specialist should be named and shamed.

Spider1V
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Although the honorable member from Spain raises a good question, as an organisation we can not 'Name and Shame' due to European laws on slander. The best way we as an organisation can deal with this is to help; new,old and members of the public be careful and do the research before they enter the world of G Wagens.

Its a great shame, but that's what the forum is here for, to help members make an informed choice and warn people wherever we can.

Spider1V

SierraTango
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

If that was my own work I'd be gutted but I'm not in the trade and so would only have myself to blame. I cannot imagine the financial and mental strain something like this would cause an owner. All information is good information so thank you Axel. 

prwales
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

it is only "libel" if it isn't true, slander is verbal communication

IanA2
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

True, and indeed the laws changed on 1st January 2014. If the individual were to be named and someone was to opine that the work was cr@p/sh$te etc then there would be no case in law. Ianal but that's my understanding of the new law intoduced to stop libel tourism.

 

That said, I feel for the unlucky person that was mugged and robbed by the "G-expert". I would be spitting blood and phoning my lawyer. Not an easy thing to do at the same time you understand smiley

derekfinn
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Be super careful. Do not get into a public name and shame - it's not worth it. EU defamation legislation is complex enough to tie up an organization for years. 

The main point is well made above - if your getting major works done on a fairly specialist vehicle such as a G, like a restoration or engine conversion, make sure you check out perspective service provider and then check again. Never pay up front and progress check as work proceeds. Only pay final account once your satisfied with work done.There should always be a written form of agreement outlining scope of work and upfront cost estimate not to be exceeded withour prior written authorization. 

What would be great is a GWOA endorsed list of restoration and conversion experts updated annually based on GWOA members feedback ??

Audiominx
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Having spoken to a solicitor about another matter but a similare kind of thing, I was told that one can say 'my personal opinion is such that'.... or my considered opinion is.... as long as you make it clear that it is only your opinion and not that you are claiming it to be fact

Spider1V
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Hi All,

Many thanks for your comments and thoughts, I would like to keep the thread on track if possible? I am happy to open another thread where we can debate the differences and various legalese. laugh

The object of this thread is to reinforce the ideal of the GWOA in working to help newer members who want to get into G ownership and not 'Nerd' them to death with arguments on what is what. I don't ask this often, but if we can keep this to logging and sharing our; findings, advice, guidance etc  I would really appreciate it from members. 

Please feel free to share some good news as well, especially if it is gleaned from our warnings/advice on this thread or infill on anything that may have been missed.

Many thanks

Joe Askew
Southern Area Rep
GWOA
(aka Spider1V)
 
fredecosse
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

 

There is a large number of forum user selling there services but hiding behind a member number or a name on the forum, it is not clear at all who belongs to the gwoa or who is selling services, i think any dealers or proffesssional should be signed on as proffessional below there name then clearly up to the members to decide to buy or not. It can be very confusing to receive advice by pm or on the forum from name without knowing if it is a genuine forum and G entousiaste user or a proffesional that will eventually try to earn a few notes from it.

Naming one guy doesnt help at all, for all of us that has been on here for such a long time have found it hard over the years to figure out who is a dealer or not, never mind how hard it will be for all the new forum user. Also finding one or two dirty trades man is not unusal in the car trade.

how many dealers have we seen for the last ten/twelve years??  Not to name any , quite a few of you are using the forum to sell parts, sell cars, sell any kind of conversion ..... we know who you are but not all members know, can the gwoa ask forum user to show if they are proffessional or not to other forum users????

peter perfect
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep
Define professional ?..does that mean they are a registered company ?, a business or just that they think they are...or that a members opinion of the work carried out was done by a professional..a can of worms in my eyes...having said that, it would be beneficial to have an area where people can recommend their own experiences from who they have had work done, pictures also, and are pleased with the result....let's not forget your club is a limited company with directors on the board..don't put them in any predicament !
prwales
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Bells of Coldstream [ask for Scot] are amongst the most knowledgable dealers now known as Western Mercedes if you want parts

Kevin James [Stuttgart Garage] is a reputable and very experienced Mercedes Benz specialist in Pontypridd

Axel and Tony Bruegger are the blokes to contact if you want to insert a turbo diesel into your truck,

Committee members and other long standing members can add to this list as its purely my experience, of these I can only directly vouch for Kevin, who has serviced by truck and carried out repairs too

montreal
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

My G sold today. Thanks for the comments


D

tony.bruegger
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Just to add to the kind mention

I am a G enthusiast and specialise in 5 cylinder turbo engines and 6 speed gearboxes ,mostly for my own amusement.

I also have done welding work on a number of G's for members

As an offshoot from my main business { suppling vehicle spares to west Africa ] I offer 606 and 662 ' takeouts ' for sale.As stated in previous posts the engine is the cheapest part of a conversion ,esp with a 606.

As a guide allow £5000 for a 5 cylinder and close to £10000 for a 6 cylinder into a 460 .UNLESS you have skilled help or ability of your own.

'Axel' is an old friend and neighbour.He is a highly skilled engineer who has ,in the course of his business ,  developed these upgrades to a very high standard ,however he does not ' suffer fools gladly ' and neither of us has the time or inclination to hand hold those who wish to do the job themselves and whose eyes are often bigger than their stomachs.

That said ,we both are happy to give broad brush advice and site visits to GWOA members - test drives are availble but may leave you profoundly dissatisfied with the performance of your own G !!

Norfolk66
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Tony,

I will be visiting both you and Axel very soon to have a ride in one of your 662's.

Hope you are not suffering from the bad weather in Somerset but should I bring my canoe just in case :-)

Regards

Tim

diesel_jim
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

I met Mike Axel yesterday, and Tony, and Mark....

 

And came away buying Marks 280GE!  So now I'm an official G owner (well, I will be next week when I collect it)

 

These chaps are overflowing with advice and useful tips... bit like me with LR defenders really; I just need to re-learn it all now for a different vehicle.

 

Can't wait to get a 606 into mine.

SierraTango
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Re: A Message/advice from the Southern Rep

Ha, expensive visit! Welcome to the club! laugh